News Channel 8's Interview with COK's Paul Shapiro

Eighty-five percent of the nation's egg producers now use the "Animal Care Certified" logo. That logo means the companies agree to some basic standards about animal care. But videotape of a Maryland egg farm obtained by the ABC 7 I-Team reveals some of the conditions that are allowed under those guidelines and those conditions may shock some consumers.

I-Team reporter Andrea McCarren filed this report.

[Video and transcript from "Egg Fraud," a WJLA ABC-7 I-Team report which ran on Thursday, July 15, 2004, can be found here.]

Joining us now, Paul Shapiro, Campaigns Coordinator of the group Compassion Over Killing. They're an animal advocacy organization.

News Channel 8's Bruce DePuyt: What is "Animal Care Certified" supposed to mean?

Paul Shapiro: Well, if you read the United Egg Producers' own guidelines for "Animal Care Certified" eggs, they permit producers to cage birds so tightly they can't flap their wings, to burn parts of their beaks off without painkiller, and to starve them to the point where they've lost 30 percent of their body weight. This isn't only a case of massive animal cruelty; this is also a case of consumer fraud, and we shouldn't put up with it.

DePuyt: Do you think there is a disconnect between the idea communicated by the logo—what the average Joe Public, Joe Citizen expects when they see something like that logo on a food carton—versus the reality in the field?

Shapiro: Absolutely, Bruce. When a consumer sees a logo reading "Animal Care Certified," they infer a message—mainly that these hens are treated humanely when, in fact, very little could be further from the truth. If you visit EggScam.com you can see photos for yourself of what conditions these birds are kept in. And it's nothing short of animal abuse. If these birds were dogs or cats, it would be animal cruelty and the perpetrators would be thrown in jail. It's only because they're farmed animals and they have no legal protection that factory farmers can get away with such horrific animal cruelty.

DePuyt: Now, what do you say to the argument that close to 99 percent of the animals are well cared for, well treated, and that this is some sort of selective, matching together of video images to make it look like there is just, basically, total disregard for the animals' welfare.

Shapiro: Well, there is total disregard for animal welfare within the egg industry. Even in Andrea McCarren's piece, she noted that every row she went in had dead birds, piles of feces, and even a heap of carcasses at the end. This investigation at this Maryland egg farm is only one in a series of undercover investigations at egg farms across the country that paint a pretty dark picture of the egg industry, an industry that intensively confines hundreds of millions of birds in cages so tight that they can't even flap their wings. If you read the "Animal Care Certified" guidelines themselves, which are available at EggScam.com, you can see how much abuse is actually tolerated in this voluntary program.

DePuyt: When we come back, I want to talk to you about steps you think government and consumer groups could take, should take, to improve the situation. We'll take a quick break here and then continue our discussion.

[commercial break]

DePuyt: Paul Shapiro of the group Compassion Over Killing is with us here this Friday on NewsTalk. Good to have you there, everybody. Bruce DePuyt with you. We're talking about the egg industry and the use of the "Animal Care Certified" logo. Does it mean what consumers think that it does? What should government, regulatory groups, and consumer groups do to end some of the practices that seem to be so vivid and troubling in Andrea McCarren's I-Team piece?

Shapiro: Sure. Let me go on both of those routes—both consumers and government. The best thing that consumers can do to help end this animal cruelty is simply to leave eggs out of their shopping carts. Many people stopped eating veal in the 1980s after they learned how horrific the treatment of calves who were raised for veal was, and we need to start thinking about eggs the way many people currently think about veal: It's just too much cruelty for any humane person to support. Now, what can government do....

DePuyt: Let me stop you there. Is it painting with too broad a brush to say that there are no manufacturers, no farms anywhere that follow guidelines and practices that the average person could feel comfortable with?

Shapiro: Certainly there are some farms that are less abusive than others, but it's really the case that in most of commercial egg production, there is still going to be some level of animal suffering. And there's certainly no such thing as a cruelty-free slaughterhouse, which is where all of these egg-laying hens end up going. However, what the government can do is to do exactly what Austria did last month, which was vote to ban the use of these "battery cages." These are standard in the United States. These cages that hold seven, eight, nine hens, that give them each less than a single piece of paper's worth of space per bird. Now, Austria just voted to ban these. Germany has already voted to ban these. Switzerland has banned them. And the entire European Union is going to have them phased out by 2012.

DePuyt: The idea being that if the animal has no space, no ability to move or do anything, its quality of life is pretty much zero.

Shapiro: That's exactly right. It's hard to reduce their welfare any more after you prevent them from moving at all. Life in a battery cage is a living hell. It's an archaic system. It needs to be banned and it's going to be banned. In Europe, they're already moving in that direction, and, in the United States, that's most likely where we're going to go, too.

DePuyt: We invited a representative from the United Egg Producers industry group to join us, and they declined. They also question, as you gathered from Andrea's report, the authenticity of the video, but the I-Team stands by its work. Let's go to the phones and speak with Pierre in Silver Spring. Pierre, you're on NewsTalk. Hi.

Caller: Well, first of all, I want to say I love the show and I think you're doing a great service in fostering these discussions. And, you know what? I've seen these investigations before, and they all look the same. The treatment is the same all over the country. It's deplorable. And I really think this group is right on with what they're doing. Ethical people should ask themselves, "Should I eat eggs if it's supporting this much cruelty?" And I think they have to come to the conclusion that they should just not eat eggs.

DePuyt: Pierre, thanks very much. We're seeing throughout the marketplace, if you will, more people trying to buy "free-range" this and "organic" that. I think, though, a lot of consumers have to wonder, "Am I getting what I hope I'm getting?"

Shapiro: That's certainly the case, and there could be no clearer case of that than with "Animal Care Certified." Poll after poll has shown that consumers think "Animal Care Certified" means "humane," when, in fact, very little could be further from the truth. In fact, the Better Business Bureau has ruled on two occasions that this is a misleading logo and it should be discontinued or modified. And the same is true with some other logos, too, but it's especially true with this "Animal Care Certified" logo, which is particularly deceptive and it masks particularly egregious, cruel, and abusive practices by factory farmers.

DePuyt: Your organization continues to work undercover, if you will, to learn more about what conditions actually are?

Shapiro: Absolutely. There are no laws that protect farmed animals while they're on the farm. We feel this is extremely important work to document their suffering and to show it to the public so that consumers can make informed decisions as to what types of practices they feel comfortable supporting.

DePuyt: Paul Shapiro of Compassion Over Killing, thanks for joining us.

Shapiro: Thank you, Bruce.